The Christian persecution complex
12 December 2008 by Stardust
In my opinion the Christian persecution complex is just an emotional game that Christians (and those of other religions) play when they are backed into a corner and cannot answer questions asked of them. When their god does not come to their aid, when their minds go blank, they turn on the boo-hooing tactics to distract from the real fact that they just don’t have any answers to back up what they are professing to believe in. The persecution tactic is turned on when religious folks cannot get their way concerning issues of separation of church and state. They turn on the tears when they are not allowed to impose their personal religious beliefs on others.
Here is a good essay written by Rob Boston
Persecution Complex: Why Religious Right Claims Of Hostility Toward Christians Ring Hollow
Yesterday I received an e-mail from the Rev. Donald Wildmon’s American Family Association advertising a new DVD titled “Speechless: Silencing the Christians.”
“Facing rising persecution and discrimination, many Christians feel hopeless, uncertain what to do,” reads the promotional copy. The e-mail promises that I will learn “how you can be prepared if you feel the pressure to be silenced for your faith.”
This is the sort of bullcrap propaganda that religious leaders brainwash their sheeple with. When backed into a corner, and have no answers, start belly-aching and boo-hooing persecution.
Are Christians being persecuted in America?
In a word: no.
What’s happening is that fundamentalists of Wildmon’s ilk constantly try to use the power of the government to promote their narrow faith or foist it onto others. When they are told to stop, they start screaming about persecution.
Exactly.
12 December 2008, on 4:46 pm
“The best defense is a good offense”, and religions, all of them, are very offensive (disgusting), not only to me, but especially to each other! That is why in all of recorded history, the primary cause of death has more often been religion.
12 December 2008, on 8:07 pm
Religion is that ultimate party crasher. You know the one you just didn’t invite but shows up anyhow. They seem to love insinuating themselves into every facet of life. OHHH but just tell them to leave and they become offended.
I personally consider it a mild form of learned mental retardation. But that is just me. I also consider my exposure to the Jehovah Witnesses to be one of the most beneficial events that led me to non-belief. Once they put the religious aspect out of the conversation they are actually really decent people. Although a bit delusional. The thing is that they are compelled to proselytyze and “Crash the Party”.
Is it really any wonder that they cry like sissies when they go where they aren’t welcome?
12 December 2008, on 11:04 pm
“Speechless: Silencing the Christians.”
Telling someone to STFU because we’ve heard it all before and it still sounds retarded is not “silencing”. Telling someone that they are not allowed to speak their views is “silencing”, but when it is part of the same rules that everyone else has to abide by, you are only being a whiny twit if you start weeping about it (I, of course, am talking about separation of church and state issues right now; in contrast to, you know, telling them to just shut their trap in personal conversation with them).
And if the thing you are claiming to be “silenced” about is your homophobic clap-trap, well…then I guess you people are more pathetic than I ever previously imagined.
Man. I’ve been watching them pull this crap for years, yet it never ceases to raise my ire. Can’t be good for our health. I swear that they are just trying to be as whiny, hypocritical, mean, and retarded as possible intentionally in order to prompt is into looking like fools, or killing us all of by increasing our susceptibility to heart disease as we cringe wrathfully at every baseless assertion they make.
12 December 2008, on 11:16 pm
The persecution complex that many xtians seems to love (and believe me, most of them do love it secretly) I hypothesize to be caused and reinforced by two major factors:
1. In the early history of the faith, adherents truly were prosecuted. You think an atheist posting a billboard next to your plastic baby jesus doll is persectution? Try being fed to the lions or hung upside down on a cross to slowly asphixiate.
So their holy book says they will be persecuted. Because when this stuff was written, well, they truly were persecuted. But the authors couldn’t have possibly foreseen the year 2008, where megachurches are the norm, xtians are the majority and the religion baring the same name as theirs carries little resemblance to their own tribal cult. Hell, they couldn’t have foreseen the year 2008, period.
But the “Good Book” says you will be persecuted if you believe and, what do you know, suddenly you have to search out persecution, wherever it may be hiding. Add some ludicrous stories and a few people willing to rightfully make fun of those stories (or simply deny the likelyhood of said stories) and you’ve got yourself some religious persecution.
2. People of faith realize their beliefs are hard to swallow. They really do. Most will admit this if pressed (at least most I have spoken too.) But it’s easier (or at least more comfortable) to believe in the logically tenuous if everyone else believes too. It’s the logical fallacy of “validity with numbers.” When people start throwing reason at the believer, or start insisting on a church/state barrier, xtians do indeed feel persecuted because, well, barriers are being thrown up in the effort to “encourage” nonbelievers to join in their delusion.
Persecution garners sympathy, and hey, who doesn’t like a little sympathy? Hell, it’s been the very basis of my sex-life for years!
12 December 2008, on 11:42 pm
Would somebody…Stardust?…throw that annoying little animated (bastard Jeebus?) baby out…
WITH the bathwater?
[Is my NOT having been a parent obvious enough by that remark...or...FINALLY; a chance to express that old phrase in an appropriately 'mean-spirited' manner!...as is my wont?]
Seriously…Good article; and some interesting followup comments…even a few from NON-RR Christians.
To me, it boils down to that famous Jack Nicholson line…with appropriate adjustment, of course…
“Religious believers can’t handle the Truth!”
Then again…what IS the Ultimate Truth? To me, ONE alternate answer is…
“We REALLY don’t know!…AND, THAT’S OK!”…cause we’re good enough…smart enough…and…doggone it…
…fellow atheists like us?”
[And I ask you, dear GifSters...kidding, of course...when the fuck WILL we know if Al Franken is going to be a MN Senator or not? Sheesh with the recount, already! Oh, wait...I'm an Illinoisian voter...silly me; complaining about that little trivial Political matter!]
13 December 2008, on 9:26 am
Would somebody…Stardust?…throw that annoying little animated (bastard Jeebus?) baby out…
WITH the bathwater?
ChuckA, does the crying baby just annoy you or is it making the page hard to load? I wondered about it being a problem after I posted it…anyone else having a problem with crying animated baby? If so, I will change it to a regular image.
13 December 2008, on 11:51 am
I love the tantrum throwing baby. Didn’t make it hard to load for me. But dial-up folks might have to wait for it.
13 December 2008, on 12:33 pm
“ChuckA, does the crying baby just annoy you or is it making the page hard to load?”
I was just KIDDING, Stardust…
It’s only real life crying babies that annoy me; sorta like the old…fingernails on a blackboard routine. For me, that only happens when I’m shopping in some dumb Super Market…and fortunately…quite rarely.
Like I mentioned…I didn’t have any kids; nor ‘endured’ any baby sitting…D’uh!
What!…I was influenced too much by W. C. Fields when I was growing up?…
“Ah yes, indeed…the little tykes!…Reminds me of when I was on my way to Cookamonga!”
Hey…it’s an excellently rendered, funny animation…AND…there’s NO SOUND with the image…sooooo…
I vote…leave it as is?
Sorry for bringing it up?…OR…like Fagan, nervously exclaiming, in the 1968 movie: “Oliver”:
“EVERYBODY REMAIN CALM!”
13 December 2008, on 1:28 pm
The crying baby is eye-catching. As soon as I saw it on your site, I felt as if I read the whole post before I even started. That baby is the reason we keep “In God We Trust” on our currency, to name but one of his many accomplishments.
13 December 2008, on 2:04 pm
ok…crying baby animation stays, and maybe will become our traditional boo-hooing xian icon. When I saw it I thought it was an awesome visual of what these fundies act like when they start their bawling about their religious bullshit.
16 December 2008, on 3:54 am
Hello, I randomly stumbled onto this site and am blown away by the vitriolic hatred I’m reading. I come from a theistic background, yet a number of my friends are atheists. We all get along fine and respect each other. I can tell you that when they’re not around, I’m not ranting about them.
I realize this is an insider site, and you all probably possess more tact in mixed circles, but I have to tell you that scathing hatred and condescension are never productive forces in humanity. If you confront religious adherents with the assumption that they’re borderline retarded homophobic bigots, you don’t leave them a lot of wiggle room to respond kindly. Nor do you provide much incentive for them to join you.
I think it’s possible some of you are working out some pretty complex emotional issues, and wish you well in that regard.
16 December 2008, on 10:26 am
Harold, it sounds as if you have a bit of leftover persecution complex yourself if you felt compelled to stop by and leave your little message indirectly in defense of your own beliefs.
We all get along fine and respect each other. I can tell you that when they’re not around, I’m not ranting about them.
Do god believers ever stop to think before they make this statement? You pray for these atheist friends to be “saved” from the sins you imagine they have week after week in your churches, and maybe even in private. Have you thought, Harold about how your “theistic” background is unbelievably hateful and even violent?
How many of these “atheist friends”, who you say you harbor no ill-will for, do you believe will burn in eternal flaming torment (assuming you believe in the hellfire and damnation part of your religion)? That is your religion, that is what it teaches you. And that is why we have websites like these. To express our displeasure and keep each other informed about what the god botherers are doing. You cannot say that you have respect for your so-called “atheist friends” if you believe in a god who would do them harm for simply not being able to believe in him.
You are accusing us of “Scathing hatred”? What world are you living in? Have you even listened and understood the news lately about all the “loving Xians” working to keep bigotry alive? And as far as incentive for intelligent Christians to “join us”…we don’t need to recruit them because they already lead the way. Just check out the Americans United for Separation of Church and State led by the Rev. Barry Lynn. Are they hateful too because they speak out to keep evangelical and fundamentalist Christians at bay?
Harold writes
Harold, it is not our intention to “confront” religious adherents…but some like yourself seek us out and when they do, they will not like what they read and no amount of coaxing them is going to change their mind. Most of them are indeed even more than retarded homophobic bigots and are not interested in “responding kindly”. But a few, even maybe yourself, read atheist blogs because you are interested in what we have to say, and maybe you are even “working out some pretty complex emotional issues” yourself.
And you lie if you say you “wish us well” because that is not what the Xian religion teaches. Your religion teaches hatred of those who are different, you use your ancient mythology book to interpret it any way you want to back up your prejudices and whatever you want to believe. Some interpret it as some sort of fluffy fairy tale of goodness, then others use it to condemn and hate. That is the dangerous side of religion and why we must constantly watchdog the religious right.
And when people, liberal Christians, liberal other god botherers, atheists, secular humanists, etc. speak out when the religious right violate or are attempting to violate the rights of others, the evangelicals and fundies start boo-hooing that they are being persecuted. That is what this post was about, and you are sort of proving my point.
(And if you want an example of true “vitriolic hatred” check out this Christian site, Harold — God Hates Fags…we seem like little kittens compared to that.)
16 December 2008, on 11:00 pm
Nicely done, Star!
Harold: Hello, I randomly stumbled onto this site and am blown away
Bullshit. You’re uncomfortable because we’re not kissing religious ass. The fact that our criticism of religion and believers disturbs you reveals how insecure you actually are in your faith. If you weren’t, you wouldn’t care less about being called a sucker, let alone stop and take the time to comment and try to twist our words into something that makes you feel better about believing.
Harold: by the vitriolic hatred I’m reading.
Translation: “Daddy, those mean atheists are saying mean things about religion again – and they’re cussing while they’re doing it!”
Harold: I can tell you that when they’re not around, I’m not ranting about them.
Why should you? It’s not like they’re part of a majority that’s ruining this country, all while feeling entitled to ruin it, and trying to force their ways and beliefs on everyone who’s not one of them. No one’s vandalizing your property, or denying you equal representation in government, or openly trying to silence you and your views.
Harold: I have to tell you that scathing hatred and condescension are never productive forces in humanity.
Oh, sure – if they’re aimed at actual human beings who do nothing to deserve them (I gather you’re referring to the oppressed gay minority in this country, currently being denied equal rights under the law – right?).
But scathing hatred and condescension aimed at imaginary characters, ideas, concepts, structures, individuals as public figures (such as, yes, Bush), or groups united by those beliefs, ideas, etc. (such as, for example, al Qaeda)? Absolutely they can be productive! That’s what satire and criticism are for, channeling those emotions into exposing flaws and outright dangers, calling for action to counteract those flaws and dangers. You want productive condescension? How about the Founding Fathers’ calling the government legally in authority over them tyrannical, despotic, oppressive, enslaving, a force that not only should but must be opposed and overthrown, with violence if need be?
And what is it with the religious and denying human emotion anyway? You know damn well you yourself feel frustration, anger, even hatred, and pretending you don’t or bottling it up inside while trying desperately to cover its existence is like accidentally having diarrhea on the carpet, and instead of acknowledging its presence, steeling yourself to face and clean it up, then figuring out why you have the runs in the first place and addressing that cause, no matter how unpleasant it may be, you spray it with air freshener, pop a flower pot on top, and pretend nothing’s happened and “smell? What smell? I don’t smell anything…”
As Star points out above, xianity itself is rife with hateful ideas, concepts, calls to action as well. Calling gay sex an “abomination” is hatred, and denying gays equal civil rights is hateful. And as for condescension, even the character Jesus calls Jewish priests, legally recognized community leaders over him and at the very least his peers as fellow human beings, “hypocrites,” blind guides, fools, serpents, and vipers.”
Harold: If you confront religious adherents with the assumption that they’re borderline retarded homophobic bigots, you don’t leave them a lot of wiggle room to respond kindly. Nor do you provide much incentive for them to join you.
So? You yourself admitted that neither you nor we do this on a regular basis nor in person out there in the “real” world. You also conveniently fail to acknowledge that there are plenty of places, both virtual and actual, where non-confrontational, mutually beneficial encounters between religious and atheists occur, and groups of widely varying stances and beliefs come together and cooperate.
But this particular site is not always one of those places. We make it very clear right from the get-go – starting with our very name! – that this is a site primarily meant for atheists, agnostics, and other non-religious and various freethinkers, etc. to wander in unannounced, plop down on the couch, kick off their shoes, prop their feet up on the coffee table, quaff a virtual libation of their choice, and vent. Like all venting, it’s often unexpurgated. Heated. Maybe even – oh, I’m about to get the vapors! – uncouth. Downright dirty. And yes, confrontational.
I mean, what are you and other theists, made of glass? Afraid to allow a single unexpected “fuck” to fly out or around you in case you shatter into a million pieces? So what if someone is so frustrated at the end of a day dealing with religious types of a particular ilk, or at their wit’s end handling fundamentalist relatives, or upset at the way a specific encounter turned out that they rant and rave about those “borderline retarded homophobes” who just took away their right to marry the person they love and want to share their life with?
The fact is that even theists have thoughts like these all the time, and lose it once in a while to the point of actually uttering a – gasp! – insult. It’s much better to have a place where you can lose it, get it out of your system, and breathe freely enough to recoup your energies for the inevitable situations yet to come than to spray air freshener on the shit, pop a flower pot over it, and pretend you can’t smell anything until the stench is so bad it permeates your entire being.
Harold: I think it’s possible some of you are working out some pretty complex emotional issues, and wish you well in that regard.
Hmm, project much? I’m guessing that like many theists who have been convinced or have convinced themselves that strong feelings are “bad,” you have difficulties acknowledging your own, let alone expressing them appropriately. You’re also rather transparently employing another common believer’s tactic, trying to demean and thus avoid addressing our actual criticisms and arguments by labelling us as unhappy/angry/depressed/disturbed.
You’re not fooling anyone…
17 December 2008, on 1:04 am
Stardust and Eve…”You’re SO attractive (and sexy?) when you do that!”
What’s that?…
“Do Vaht?”
OT…here’s a link to a BBC Message board on Religion & Ethics…specifically…”Christian topic.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/mbreligion/F2213235?thread=6133387&skip=0&show=20
My companion pointed it out to me. There are quite a few, rather consistently highly intelligent, atheist comments and retorts.
Not surprisingly, of course…especially considering it’s mainly (I’m assuming) a British audience…?
What!…”Oh those brainy Brits!”?
[Yeah...like...Home of Darwin, Dawkins, Hawking, Shakespeare, and...erm...
Henry the (fucking) 8th? Yada, yada.]
17 December 2008, on 2:05 am
Harold, do you love me?
17 December 2008, on 7:45 am
Well, the Divine Command Theory of Morality is essentially infantile (pre-conventional, stage 1: obedience and punishment driven), so why should their debating tactics be any different?