The “Threat” of College?
31 August 2007 by Bob
This comes from that Billy Graham advice column…
Q. I’m headed for college in a few weeks, and as a Christian I’m wondering what to expect. Some people say that my faith will be attacked there, and I’m not sure I’m ready for that. Do you have any advice for me?The most important advice I can give you is to keep your eyes on Christ, and not let yourself be turned away from him. Satan will do everything he can to turn you away from Christ, but don’t give in to his pressures. God’s Word says, “I have no greater joy than to hear that my children are walking in the truth” (3 John 1:4).
In what ways might your faith be attacked? One way, of course, will be by those who don’t believe in Christ, and may actually mock the gospel or attack it. And this won’t happen only in the classroom; some of your fellow students may be even more scornful of the gospel than the occasional atheistic professor. But even if you can’t answer all their questions, they aren’t the first ones to raise them, and scholarly Christians have provided answers. Your local Christian bookstore can help you find them.
Your children are mine, I tell you! MINE! ALL MINE! BWAHAHAHAHA!…
Seriously, I can’t speak to any formal student-on-student religious harassment (I don’t hear about those stories; I only hear about the ones that involve attacking other students because of their sexual orientation — you know, those other good xian stories), but I can quite confidently say that I’ve never “attacked” the religious beliefs of students on campus. If the subject of god comes up — and it’s inevitable, given my discipline — I simply present the arguments and objections and let the students decide for themselves.
I mean, it’s not as if I have to put any real effort into it: my discipline (at least in the West) is over 2000 years old, so enough has been written to watch it work all by itself. And for the 0.1% of students that actually listen and think, it can actually be quite freeing. The look on their faces is priceless.
But, no surprise, the other 99.9% simply ignore the lecture and go back to what they were taught when they were kids (when, of course, they knew better). Add to this the obvious fact that here in the Midwest there are numerous student religious organizations on campus, and not even one student atheist/agnostic organization, and it becomes more and more difficult to feel sorry for the student-believers.
So, for the worried xian parents out there sending their kids to college: relax. If you indoctrinated them well — and my experience in the classroom clearly shows that you have — you have nothing to worry about. The great combination of eternal damnation and family disownment really pays off.
Hat tip to Pharyngula…
31 August 2007, on 11:58 am
The most interesting thing about Graham’s response was the “scholarly Christians have provided answers” bit. What Graham is talking about, of course, is creationism and its pseudo-scholarly counterparts in other fields. The fact that this stuff is very aggressively promoted to average believers is an important fact typically missed in news reporting on the subject.
31 August 2007, on 12:10 pm
This is friggin’ ridiculous. Unless the xian student is walking around preaching jeebus to everyone, making themselves a target, no one will say anything about it. And I can’t see professors in academic courses even bringing the issue up, unless the student tries to poke holes in science using religion. And I’d think most professors would know better than to fall for such baiting.
“I have no greater joy than to hear that my children are walking in the truth”, yeah they walk in it up to their elbows, unfortunately they wash it off every day without it sinking in. They should walk in the truth, but not eat of the tree of knowledge. Riiiiight.
31 August 2007, on 12:44 pm
Curious how they characterize what is very rare and almost always a matter of simple discussion of a topic as an “attack”. That’s the victim mindset that the religious extremists sell as part of the package. “You’re a Christian so you’re always the victim of these people. In America, they make war on Christmas.” A curious mindset for a religion that is the dominant religion in the country, that has its main holidays, and only its (no other religion’s) holidays enshrined as national holidays, that completely overpowers the public media with religious messaging for a month before its main holiday, that owns numerous television networks, that has a church on practically every corner of every town in the country, etc.
Yeah, they’re really under attack, those Christians.
31 August 2007, on 12:57 pm
This one comment at Pharyngula really cracked me up:
That’s the stuff right there…
31 August 2007, on 1:31 pm
(I don’t hear about those stories; I only hear about the ones that involve attacking other students because of their sexual orientation — you know, those other good xian stories)
I’d just like to report that a few gay couples have now been legally married in Iowa! I heard this on the 10pm news last night and literally jumped for joy. I’m quite proud to be an Iowan right now. (I’m straight, by the way.)
Of course, they’re not out of the woods yet, as the Supreme Court has to approve of the decision made by the judge. But I’m crossing my fingers.
Sorry that this is pretty much off-topic, but I just wanted to spread the real good news- ya know, equality and freedom for everyone.
Take that religious assholes who think they’re being persecuted when other people are finally given the rights that they have enjoyed unchallenged for years!
31 August 2007, on 1:32 pm
I believe that Landover Baptist Church has some excellent advice for Christian students headed back to secular schools.
31 August 2007, on 1:41 pm
Actually, Chris, according to the information in the original post and subsequent comments, what Graham is referring to are xian apologetics in order to defend yourself from attacks upon xianity itself, not literal biblical interpretations. One commenter even mentioned that Graham is not a creationist but apparently has no problem believing in evolution (well, theistic anyway; “god started it all with the Big Bang” type of thing). Compared to the current crop of rabid creationist fundagelicals, ol’ Billy comes dangerously close to being liberal!
But being mocked by a professor in class for your religious beliefs? I never saw it happen either in undergraduate or grad school myself, but then I went to a Catholic college and state university respectively, and quite frankly I found both places refreshingly open, tolerant, and respectful of people in general, both in and out of class. On the contrary, I know some atheists, like our regular AtheistUnderMask, who have reported being pressured for their lack of belief.
However, the peer pressure at university can be just as strong as in high school, although I’m the wrong person to comment on it, since I never had a problem telling my peers where to get off if they tried to get me to do something I knew was wrong or destructive or just something I didn’t want to do. Some guys circulated a rumor about me being a lesbian during my freshman year basically because I didn’t drink or sleep around; I remember that only because my roommate at the time was included in the rumor and it bothered her (me? Meh).
In fact, the rumor probably got started by the asshole who came into our room (our door was unlocked at the time) and just climbed into bed with me! He got an elbow in his ribs so hard it knocked him on the floor and a boot out the door; nobody touches Mother’s little Eve without asking for and receiving permission!
Whoa, slightly off-topic there…
31 August 2007, on 1:59 pm
I am SO turned on right now!
31 August 2007, on 4:57 pm
Re: Eve–If you look at the actual modus operandi of the apologetics industry, the line between defending inerrancy and “Mere Christianity” is pretty blurry. All the well-known apologists that the student is likely to end up reading are inerrantists, though many are selective about the occasions on which they’ll defend inerrancy for tactical reasons. That’s what the whole “Intelligent Design” movement is about: everyone in the movement would have described themselves as creationists of some stripe 20 years ago, it’s just that even the young-earthers shy away from promoting YECism for tactical reasons. And of course, the vaguer “Intelligent Design” claims aren’t much more honest or accurate than the claims of YECs.
31 August 2007, on 8:55 pm
I went to college in Nebraska, so perhaps my experience is far from typical, but there were very few “attacks” on anyone’s religious superstitions. There were the occassional snide comments (which in retrospect were quite hillarious.) No outward attacks that I can recall, unless someone was an extremist and loud about it.
I entered school a Xtian. I suspect that the “attacks” that this person may be (unknowlingly) referring to are simply 1. Reason and 2. Evidence (cue diabolical sounding 50’s horror movie organ music.) I personally suffered a great deal of existential anxiety as a result of these two “attacks” on my faith (and subsequent loss thereof). Honestly, it was traumatic, and I would never wish it on anyone or accept money to go through it again.
Ironic in my case that the Rev-rund Graham would even make the cursory, obligatory reference to atheist professors, considering the biggest challenge to my faith came from none other than the instructor of my Jewish and Christian Heritage class. He was a Methodist minister that challeged the class to not accept our beliefs simply because our parents told us to. I may have been the only one in that class that took him up on this challenge.
Ironically again, after I became an agnostic (now an atheist) I was ganged up on at least two separate occasions in college by Xtians trying to “save” me–bring me back to the light. While my Xtian beliefs were never attacked, my lack of belief was.
And actually, I agree with Eve. Although I find Rev-rund Grahams’ response to be total hogwash, at least it is relatively “measured” hogwash. Maybe that makes it more pernicious
31 August 2007, on 8:55 pm
I went to college in Nebraska, so perhaps my experience is far from typical, but there were very few “attacks” on anyone’s religious superstitions. There were the occassional snide comments (which in retrospect were quite hillarious.) No outward attacks that I can recall, unless someone was an extremist and loud about it.
I entered school a Xtian. I suspect that the “attacks” that this person may be (unknowlingly) referring to are simply 1. Reason and 2. Evidence (cue diabolical sounding 50’s horror movie organ music.) I personally suffered a great deal of existential anxiety as a result of these two “attacks” on my faith (and subsequent loss thereof). Honestly, it was traumatic, and I would never wish it on anyone or accept money to go through it again.
Ironic in my case that the Rev-rund Graham would even make the cursory, obligatory reference to atheist professors, considering the biggest challenge to my faith came from none other than the instructor of my Jewish and Christian Heritage class. He was a Methodist minister that challeged the class to not accept our beliefs simply because our parents told us to. I may have been the only one in that class that took him up on this challenge.
Ironically again, after I became an agnostic (now an atheist) I was ganged up on at least two separate occasions in college by Xtians trying to “save” me–bring me back to the light. While my Xtian beliefs were never attacked, my lack of belief was.
And actually, I agree with Eve. Although I find Rev-rund Grahams’ response to be total hogwash, at least it is relatively “measured” hogwash. Maybe that makes it more pernicious.
31 August 2007, on 8:57 pm
Sorry for the duplicate comment–don’t know how that happened.
1 September 2007, on 12:22 am
I’m surprised no one else mentioned Grahams attempt to cultivate the us vs. them mentality with the comment about “Satan” trying to turn this person from “Christ.”
Or maybe he was trying to make this person enter the school with an uppity, elitist attitude.
Or maybe both.
1 September 2007, on 1:18 am
Rules for the Outward Bound Member.
1)When the cult member is outside of the sphere of cult influence, he/she must constantly hum cult-approved soundtrack music- (ed. note: “Rock of Ages” works well so long as it is not the co-opted Def Leppard version, which is expressly forbidden except for the unidexter) loud enough inside the head to drown out potential reality’s persecution of the cult.
2) In those members whom the seed is but newly planted, earbuds will be supplied to provide constant communication with The Leader(ed. note: The member will disregard static-riddled shouts out for commercial beaver and/or massages from male escorts as there is at least a one in three chance that these are merely the intercepted ranting of long haul truckers on the CB radio and not The Leader’s personal phone calls).
3) Rather than risk reality contamination, it may become necessary relieve members of their untrustworthy eyes and virgin ears. Members need not fear such a procedure as it will be conducted by professionals highly-trained in the field of Intelligent Healing, rather than the abomination that is secular medical science.
4) Gallaudet is off-limits to de-eyed, and de-eared members.
1 September 2007, on 12:17 pm
If anyone repeats this, I’ll deny it, but I actually have a bit of respect- a jot, a tittle, for Billy Graham. Alone among the big fish of evilangelism, he’s always refrained from making his religion political- with the notable exception of taking his Crusades into the Soviet Union during the cold war, he’s never lowered himself to selling the modern equivalent of indulgences- “prayer” cloths that feel suspiciously like newsprint, “vials of “holy” water, etc., he’s remained aloof from making the usual bigoted, idiotic statements of a social conservative, he’s actually used the pecuniary fleece of his flock for the mission work it was promised to, for things besides simple proselytizing and personal lifestyle enhancement, and he’s actually walked the talk, as it were, managing to avoid the hookers- as well as the Jessica Hahn Memorial Hookers-In-Everything-But-Name, and meth-fueled butt love with male escorts*. Plus, his wife doesn’t wear clown makeup.
*- To be clear, the “meth”, the “escort”, and the hypocrisy of the act itself are the problem, not the actual “butt love” or the “male”.
I say this- but will deny it, despite having been dragged to a handful of his live Crusades at Cleveland’s Municipal Stadium, despite being on his mailing list for the last decade courtesy of my lunatic aunt, despite the fact that his parenting skills failed to keep his idiot son, Franklin from crawling up W.’s ass, and, of course, despite the fact that his “belief system” belongs in the DSM-IV.
2 September 2007, on 1:37 am
Of course, if this obviously sensitive young man was that worried about having his xianity attacked (insert Senator Craig joke here), he would attend a nice xian college, yes?
2 September 2007, on 11:00 pm
Hmmm…Jeff?
(Blame this on my being an older musician?)…
Like:
(using Arnold Schwartzkopf’s voice for the quotes…you’ll get the idea?)
Erm…
Bach the WELL Tempered Clavichord =
“I’ll be Bach!”
Whereas…
Jeff the ILL Tempered Clavier (as Himself?) =
“I WON’T be Bach!”…?
Just a little humor…
(Yeah…VERY little?)
3 September 2007, on 11:20 pm
Chuck:
ouch!
6 September 2007, on 4:43 pm
ChuckA, you beat me to the musical joke! Sorry, Jeff